That Guy

That Guy
January - April 2016
(Vegan Negative Level 4 - Lame!)

I met this guy out at an event. He seemed charming and since he is vegetarian I figured I’d give him a shot. He asked me to help him go vegan and that he’d take me out to dinner and we could go over the details of veganism. (This took me a while to pick up that this was going to be a date.)

He picks me up and we go out to dinner, my favorite Thai restaurant, we order our dinner and we get to know each other. It’s nice to go out to dinner with someone that understands veganism, so we talk about what keeps him from going vegan and other topics.
As we started dating and I learned more about him and his interests, he quickly turned into “That Guy”. He started to follow (cyber stalk) me on some of my social media accounts (Pinterest, Facebook, etc.) Oddly, I didn’t have a problem with that part, it was his use of psychedelic stimulants and going to RAVES – living out his Peter Pan Syndrome. (Being 40 and still going to RAVES, living with your mom and acting more like a teenager are the traits of this syndrome. The definition of Peter Pan Syndrome for this post is Puer Aeternus: A pop-psychology concept of a male or female adult who is socially immature)

In fact, this Peter Pan Syndrome spilled over into other parts of the short-lived relationship. I made dinner one night, asking what time he’d be heading over to my place. He told me the time and I prepared the meal accordingly to be ready for when he got there. Instead, he was an hour late and never called to be considerate of my time. By about 45 minutes of him being late, I packed up all the food that has now become leftovers. Then he said that I was overreacting, and that time doesn’t exist. His co-workers told him that he was in the wrong and his mom said I was ridiculous for taking a picture of the table setting and the food before packing everything up. I wanted him to apologize to me for being inconsiderate, and instead he didn’t care……

What he had issues with me was the fact that I wasn’t a participant of such use; and since I was in recovery of my hip surgery I’d get tired by 10 pm and want to sleep and rest. I wasn’t into the idea of starting a party at 11.30 pm.

Mentioning my hip surgery, I was in my last month of recovery when I was in a car accident. In this car accident, I suffered tearing around one of the sutures in my hip, a shoulder contusion and a muscle impingement. Needless to say, I was in need of help to walk my pups and even just getting around the apartment. Well, one would think that they could rely on the person that they’re dating to help in this kind of emergency. He told me “I can’t help you because I’ll resent you for getting stuck in traffic on my way home”. Our relationship was over after that.

I’m looking for someone who wants to be there during the hard times, not just the fun times.

Shark in the Ocean & Bats in the Sky (3rd installment)

Shark in the Ocean & Bats in the Sky (3rd installment)
August 2013; Vegan Negative Level 4 (More Lame!)

Coffee Date #2:

Shark and I meet at the Starbucks where we had our first coffee date. This time, I ran a few minutes behind. He did not have his nose in a book. By this time, after all of the conversations over the weekend and the I want to fill up the 3 hours I have free in between social engagements; I’m a little more standoffish….

He orders his black coffee and cream and I order my vanilla soy latte. Shark again pokes fun at how complicated my drink is, and I just have that feeling of déjà vu… I lead the conversation off with; “I’m not feeling the label “Veggie””. He doesn't see what’s wrong with it, and the fact that I have to explain it, makes me even more standoffish. We go sit outside at the same table, and we're making conversation. Here it comes, that moment when you know that one isn't as understanding of your lifestyle as they say (in fact, no clue!).

He brings up the question (which gives him his name). If you are swimming in the ocean and a shark is going to attack you, but you have a spear. Will you use the spear to save yourself from the shark? (I'm 34 years old-yes, real age. I've never been asked that in all of the years of being vegetarian, going vegan or on a date. WTH?! For those who love me. You know, I don’t go to the beach. I don’t go swimming, and in fact, will NOT get into the water. So, this question is insane to ask someone.) I play along, and say that if it’s my time, it’s my time and leave it that. In the rest of the conversation throughout the evening, he still brings up the shark question. Not letting it go, I cut the coffee date short after watching the bats take over the evening sky. He brings me bag full of products that his company sells. I look at it and, he’s saying don't tell me. (Yes. All the items that he sells test on animals and use chemicals that I haven’t used in years, etc. He is clueless and I'm not being a snob, I just know that he will NEVER get it.)

I send him a text saying “I'm not feeling the connection. Good luck in your search.” His response is “It must be hard to make a connection, due to my lifestyle.”

Shark in the Ocean & Bats in the Sky (2nd installment)

Shark in the Ocean & Bats in the Sky (2nd installment)
August 2013; Vegan Negative Level 2.5 (Going down!)

Conversations to get to the second date:

Shark calls and sends text messages, and I continue to flirt. “I can't wait to see you again” Shark tells me. “Ask me out for a second date, make time.” It’s not really that difficult, you like a girl, and you really want to see her again. You make time for her, that simple. Shark called me up over the weekend and wants to get together. I say “I can be ready by 3pm.” “Well, I've got plans to hang out with my friends at that time.” is his response. For me, really it’s not that big of a deal. Either you want to see me again and you make time, or you don’t. Simple, but the “I've got 3 hours to kill between the rest of my social life”. I’m worth more than that…

Shark and I continue to send text messages throughout a week time frame. (Here is where my social consciousness comes into play. I’m on Credo Mobile, a great cell network that allows me to vote on how they donate funds. Not so great when it comes to their cell plans. A girl only has “x” amount of text messages and “x” of mobile day minutes. It’s never been a problem before, but guys just like to send a smiley face 6 times a day and there are 7 days a week-quickly uses up your text messages.) I gently let him know that I have 1000 text messages to get me through the month and the 6 smiley faces need to not be so frequent. That turns into a can of worms that was way too soon to get into. So, he starts to send me e-mails. In these e-mails Shark asks me “What do people call you?” I answer “Jackie or Jacqueline” not thinking anything of it. He says “I'm going to call you Veggie.” This is a label that you give a friend, not someone that you want to date.

He tells me “I think your lifestyle is way too expensive for where you are in your life.” (That’s my choice; I'm not looking for someone to pay my bills. I’m looking for someone to share my life with.) He tells me "You need to be on Facebook, so that way you can get messages for free from your friends." (I don't need to be on Facebook for anything except for The Compassionate Vegan. My friends know how to get a hold of me. I'm good on that part.)
A girl does like to collect horrible dating stories to share with her friends (and readers). So, I continue to chat for a few more conversations and we even get to Coffee Date #2.

Shark in the Ocean & Bats in the Sky (1st installment)

Shark in the Ocean & Bats in the Sky (1st installment)
August 2013; Vegan Negative Level 1 (Less Lame!)

Coffee Date #1:

Shark sends me two e-mails from one of the dating sites that I’m on. Honestly, I didn't receive one of them, since you can't check your e-mails until you pay the fees. In our e-mails back and forth to each other, we flirt and have great chemistry. In one of the first ones, he mentions that he has come to love vegetarian food and that he respects my lifestyle. (Sounds promising, right? I thought so, too.)

Shark is the first person that I went on a date after my breakup with Bruce. On our first coffee date (at Starbucks), he was late. He did let me know that he had forgotten something at home and that he was going to be late. I let him know that I would have my nose in a book. (You see a girl always has to be prepared to entertain herself.) Shark asked “Nose in a book?”… “Why? Yes, I like to read. I'll see you when you get here” is my response.

Shark buys a coffee black and adds some cream; I get a soy vanilla latte. He starts to poke fun at how complicated my drink is. I let him in on a secret…. Friends don't let friends drink Starbucks. (I LOVE coffee, in fact I feel like it’s nectar of the gods that one gets to drink in the morning. I like it black with a little bit of sugar. However, Starbucks burns their beans and makes the coffee bitter. So, that’s when a girl has to get her girly coffee.) He continues to poke fun, which makes me think that he is the little boy on the playground pulling girls’ hair because he likes her. I'll play along.

Shark and I continue to chat, flirting and getting to know each other. The sun begins to set, and two colonies of bats begin to emerge into the darkening sky. A magical moment and we end the first date full of potential. (According to Bat for Lashes: “Never fall in love with potential”.)

The Top 5 Worst Dating Pick Up Lines (Yes, these are real!)

The Top 5 Worst Dating Pick Up Lines (Yes, these are real!)

So, in my profile I have it written that I need someone to be strong enough to tell me that I’m being irrational at times and then move on. Because, let’s face it, I’m a woman and there are moments when it happens.

The Rancher in Texas-“Stop being irrational and eat a steak. Let’s go out for dinner.”

The Joker-“Give a dog a bone, really, vegan dog food! Look, I'm just joking… It’s funny!”

The “Vegan”-“I think you're hot, and I really want to hump your leg.”

The Business Man-“Let’s have sex and sushi.” I hardly know you. “Adam and Eve didn't know each other.”

The Neighbor-“Hey there sugar tits, want to make out?”

Here is my social question

Here is my social question:
Posted to LinkedIn September 2013

I'm recently single and back in the dating scene (my ex went vegan while we were dating). Using dating sites, I've been getting matched with some that are not respectful of the lifestyle. I've also gotten e-mails from what seem to be very nice men. Lots in common, but they either like to fish and/or hunt. I don't usually respond, but I figured let me ask the question here. Am I being less tolerant? Or, am I staying true to my core values?

(This question actually had 57 comments made in the discussion over the course of 6 days... I was really surprised, since I posted the same question on Twitter and had one person answer the question.)

Here are some of the responses from LinkedIn:

Anna M.
"Am I being less tolerant?" --> Yes.

"Or, am I staying true to my core values?" --> Absolutely, and there's nothing wrong with that.

You're talking about an intimate relationship, not shopping in a store or taking a plane ride. You have every right to be more discriminating.

Personally, I find individuals who hunt / fishes and their brethren dog / cock fighting / bear baiting as mentally weak, so I also would not get intimately involved with someone with that "hobby." I'm pretty sure my closest, platonic friends don't even have that hobby.

It probably goes without saying that one should expect for the dating scene to be slower or take longer to meet a compatible someone. However, unless you enjoy wasting your time (and money) on someone whose mere hobby is in direct conflict with one of your core values, being more discriminatory will easily weed out the ones you don't want anyway.

Good luck!

My Response:
I find it difficult on SO many levels. From the animal rights, to the environmental impacts, the health impacts, world hunger and GMO and lack of regulations. For all of these reasons, I wake up every morning to work for a brighter future. Thank you both for your responses, for friends yes, I'm fine with choices people make. They will have to listen to my comments and findings, but it's still their choice. For dating, and something more long term, I just can't see myself being able to compromise my ethics....
Delete 6 days ago

Judy L.
I thought it wouldn't bother me to have a carnivore roommate - as it was just a living relationship ... but you'd be surprised how seeing the thawing chicken, the body parts wrapped in the fridge, the smell of the food cooking - it was nagging and it would bring me down.
Like (1) Reply privately Flag as inappropriate 6 days ago Alyssa P. likes this


Vasu M.
I've been vegetarian since 1982. Where are all the vegetarian women?

In the late '80s, San Diego Animal Advocates (a chapter of People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals, or PETA, before they dissolved the chapter system for legal purposes) had a booth at Koby's Swap Meet (a kind of flea market). We had volunteers staffing a booth, selling t-shirts, buttons, and bumper stickers with pro-animal and pro-environmental messages or logos. We had petitions to sign and graphic photos of animals being experimented upon, etc.

Kids would come by, and ask smart-alec questions, like, "Are the donations *really* going to the animals?" or make references to the Smiths' album Meat Is Murder.

If there were any couples passing by, it was always the women, moved by the sight of animal cruelty, who would respond, and come over to sign petitions, purchase animal paraphernalia, etc., while the men tried to act tough, as if they weren't affected by the graphic photos.

In the late '80s, Vegetarian Times reported that women are five times as likely than men to go vegetarian.

I'm surprised you're asking, "Would a vegan date a hunter or a fisherman?"

Where are all the vegetarian women? They all seem to have meat-eating husbands or boyfriends!

David A A.
same situation here - and no I would not
Like (1) Reply privately Flag as inappropriate 6 days ago Judy L. likes this

My Response:
I guess that''s why I'm asking this question. I want to date and be in a relationship with a vegan. My ex-boyfriend went vegan, saying that I "forced" him into it. I cook vegan, he ate my vegan food. I watch documentaries about vegan, environment, health, animals. He watched all of these things with me. He found that his health improved, but my "extreme" lifestyle was what he needed to protect his children from. My life revolves around a vegan lifestyle and plant based vegan diet, from education to culinary skills. And your statement is right-There are more vegetarian and vegan women.

Gerwyn M.
A vegan woman dating a hunter? Barmy. I suggest that they were not vegans but hypochondriacs.

My Response:
I really would prefer to date a vegan. The thought of kissing someone who just got through eating the flesh of animals freaks me out.
I went out on a date with a vegetarian, had great conversation, but there wasn't a spark. He hasn't called me. I can't make someone like me. You either do or don't.
Trying to be opened minded, went on a date with a nice guy. He doesn't hunt or fish, but dear lord, he eats and talks about meat all the time. Talked about eating veal, and I screamed on the inside. He calls and texts me all the time. I have to tell him that I can't get past this, even when he's finding a place that has a vegan option on the menu.
In Colorado, my friends are vegan, my co-workers some vegetarian and flex between the occasional animal flesh. It wasn't in my face like it is in Texas.
So here it is, that I go out and try the dating scene out. And, have stories to share with my friends (helping them appreciate their husbands and boyfriends)....
Delete 1 day ago Gerwyn M. likes this

From Twitter:

Mel: I think you will find love in unexpected places. Probably best not to put too many restrictions on yourself.
Retweeted by compassionate vegan

Atkins Diet vs. Vegetarian Lifestyle

Atkins Diet vs. Vegetarian Lifestyle
Sometime in 2003; Vegan Level Negative 2 (Lame!)

Here’s a blast from the past that unfortunately works incredibly well in the context of this blog: During Sometime in my 20s, one of my friends that I went to high school with set me up with a guy. For the sake of the blog (and I honestly don't remember his name), I'll call him Atkins. (For those of you who don’t recall immediately, Atkins was the name of a man who invented a diet that was based on the idea of super low carbs and ridiculously high protein intake. As it goes with most of these diets, the protein was animal based. Needless to say, this is not someone with whom I or any of my veg friends would get along with very well. This goes to show exactly how well this friend DID NOT know me.

Atkins calls me, letting me know that our mutual friend thought we would hit it off. We start chatting and in this conversation, he asks me out. Thinking we had some things in common I say "Yes, I'd like to.” Atkins suggests that we go to dinner and a movie (knowing what I know now, not the best first date idea). We continue to chat and I continue to flirt. Somewhere in the conversation I mention where I work and he mentions things that are important to him. (I really wish I could give more details, he really didn't give off a lot of sparks.) We set the date and end the call. I call our friend, and say he's charming, and seems nice. (Well that doesn't always mean anything.)

Atkins calls me at work and says, “I have a better idea for a date, my brother got tickets to the monster truck show. Cool, right?" (As you will get to know, I'm not really a monster truck show girl. In fact, I'm not really into the whole Honey BooBoo lifestyle.) To which my response was "You said dinner and a movie. I'm pretty sure we won't be able to hear each other in conversation at a monster truck show." (Not like one can really talk in a movie theater.) I tell my co-workers about the "date change suggestion" and they laugh. Trying to picture this one is REALLY funny: I wear heels ALL of the time (to this day) and always have my hair done, primped and prissy to all get out!!!

Here it comes to the date. I suggest a Chinese food restaurant that I used to eat at a lot so I know my usual and he orders a beef dish. We continue to chat and he's losing his charm quickly. (do you remember any examples? Maybe specifically anti-veg stuff?) Atkins complains about the food (anything beef is foreign to me), then he mentions "I should have taken you to Las Palapas. They have better food." (Let me explain: you go to Las Palapas when you've been drinking for 5 hours and want greasy tacos. They cook their beans with bacon fat, thus rendering a perfectly good veg meal useless to me.)

I stop flirting. Here is that final moment when I KNEW this wasn’t going to work:
Movie: Cheaper by the Dozen (Hilary Duff) or Gothika (Halle Berry and Penélope Cruz). Which one does Atkins go for? Well, I had to sit through Cheaper by the Dozen. Yes, he chose teen over adult. I was done and after the movie I used the excuse "it's getting late and I have an early meeting in the morning." He dropped me off at home (no goodnight kiss, no way!) and after he left, I went to meet my friends out for drinks!